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Most Challenging Course to you? Options
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 10:39:32 AM

Rank: Veteran

Joined: 5/11/2004
Posts: 136
Location: NKY
NEngle - The problem with your "green in regulation" idea is that you'll have a hard time defining a disc golf green.

I can't find it at the moment, but the "green in regulation" idea has been replaced (more or less) by "average number of putts". Someone decided (after eating WAY too many numbers) that the average number of "putts" per 18 hole round is 30. Or approx. 1.6 putts per hole. Par (to be seen as a reasonable score) then becomes the hole distance divided by some factor (such as the average drive for a group of people) plus the 1.6 putts per hole.

I didn't make that up. Not nearly that clever. And the folks who did probably eat spreadsheets for breakfast laugh

As to challenging. I think the Pig layout at Harbin plays more to my weakness(es) than any of the courses around here. I should score better there, but never do.
Ben Shooner
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 12:23:53 PM

Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/16/2003
Posts: 253
To me-Mt. Airy is the gold standard for disc golf due to its variety. This also makes it one of the most difficult IMO. It doesn't have a ton of par 2s like Harbin-nor is it a long wooded par 72 like Idlewild. Some holes are long, wooded and beastie-and some are short ones that you really should get. This balance is what makes it hard to shoot 54 or less. You pretty much need to not mess up on the tough holes-AND get all the birdies (1,5,11,13 at least). If you have a really bad hole, it's not as easy to right the ship as it is on longer courses where overall scores are higher.
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 12:28:41 PM

Rank: Veteran

Joined: 6/9/2007
Posts: 217
Location: Noakley
I've come to think that Par should be count the number of reasonable shots to get you within 30 feet of the basket where the rules change to falling putts being no good. The rules change should be the criteria for where a 'green' starts and stops. Thus...by my calculation Winton Woods is a Par 39...2's except 4, 12, & 16.....and Woodland Mound would be a Par 44...4,5,7,8,10,11,12,13 being 3's. Thus my personal par for Harbin would be 36+13 extra shots for a par 49. However...I don't expect to shoot those. My personal best at Winton is -10 by 3's. I shot two -7's during the NYD tourney so maybe I can beat that when the weather warms. My personal best at Woodland Mound is -10 by 3's also...eventhough Woodland would be a higher par course I find it easier to shoot below 'par' there than Winton. My personal best at Harbin is probably a +7 by 3's. By my new calculations a 61-49 means I'd be +12 on my best day there.

I'd figure up my calculations for Banklick and Idlewild and Mt Airy...but I'd have to whip out the calculator for them.
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 1:37:13 PM

Rank: Extreme Veteran

Joined: 4/4/2006
Posts: 515
Location: Lebanon, OH
I could care less about par. It's how I do against other players that matters to me. And although par is supposed to represent that, it doesn't do a very good job. I think the reason is because players have different strengths and weaknesses on different courses. Thus returning us to the topic of this thread.

The way I evaluate a course is by what a decent round of mine would be rated in a PDGA tournament because that tells me how challenging the course is to my personal skills.

So Harbin kicks my butt and frustrates the hell out of me. Every hole is just outside my range, and the course doesn't punish you for inaccurate shots. I might as well drive half the holes blindfolded, throw my upshot, and drop it in for a 3. A 920 rated round is about "par" for me. Whereas, at a course like Idlewild, I'm disappointed if I don't shoot at least a 970 round.
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 2:51:06 PM

Rank: Elite Veteran

Joined: 8/10/2004
Posts: 455
Good point Dan.

If you want to boost your player rating, you should not play the courses out of your wheelhouse.
If you have good distance, but not much finess, just play the "White Park type" courses.
Similarly, if you have good finess, but not much "D", avoid the "White Park type" courses and play only the tight "Hobson/Monroe type" courses instead.
If a player wants to really improve though, playing "all" types of courses is best.
Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 10:50:04 PM

Rank: Extreme Veteran

Joined: 4/4/2006
Posts: 515
Location: Lebanon, OH
Just to clarify, I didn't say anything about trying to improve my player rating. I use my round rating to evaluate how challenging a course is for me. I still play Harbin even if it is futile, and even though it does not make me a better player. :banghead2
Posted: Thursday, January 31, 2008 1:48:55 PM

Rank: Elite Veteran

Joined: 8/10/2004
Posts: 455
It is not futile if you learn to reach and birdie many of the holes that were previously out of range, thus improving your score, self player view (is that the id or ego?) AND player rating.
Just this past year, I learned, from watching another player (yes, although I am an old dog), how to reach hole #1 at Harbin (a hole which I once thought nearly impossible to reach and regularly deuce) and hope to shoot better overall scores there in '08.

Jump OVER that wall you are hitting your head into Dan.  :bounce   :smile
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